gfolkert

man wget wget -vb http://some.url.for.some/file/to/dl it would put file "dl" in the present directory you are in. So if you are in "/home/jarves/" the file will be "/home/jarves/dl" Hope this helps.

Originally posted by Timmay: Quote: Free software is good, though I find its easier to pay in the long run to get all updates. Its also getting harder and harder to find free versions on many Linux websites Harder and Harder? Try and get support for Win9X/ME as you Windows version of Choice. Microsoft is about ready to start charging for *ANY* updates (bugs or enhancements). I find this rather amusing... Upgrade to our next version it fixes the bug FOR SURE THIS TIME! Quote: Linux still has a LONG way to go to be as user friendly as Windows. User friendly is a realtive term. I find the "Simplicity of Windows" to be an Oxymoronic saying. I use Linux everyday all the time. At work, home, my PDA, my mp3/music player, my car stereo, my primary workstation, my gaming machine. There isn;t a single thing Windows does better than Linux... well except maybe in creating User Frustration! Quote: You may disagree with that, but take it from someone who runs it casually, its friendlieness sucks. Bad. All of them. Try and Run Windows casually, you shall feel the same way. Or How about you run Apple's OSX on a G-something... yeap same feeling. How about you try driving a car with a stick casually, versus driving an automagic... yeap same feeling. Quote: Well, Lindows makes it a bit easier, but you dont know what you did really. If they want to go mainstream, the average guy needs to be able to just go without all the driver and app issues I and many others have. This all comes down to vendor of said devices support for anything *OTHER* than Windows. Quote: Too bad they(Linux) cant support .exe files out of the box and ship files and drivers that way, it would make all the difference in the world. Once again pressure your vendor to get these drivers for Linux... Most everything that has support in Linux is because of some one Reverse Engineering as the vendors DO NOT understand the whole open source thing and think everything is going to be given away in Linux. No that just isn;t the deal. If you know what the issue are... you can make a difference. Linux in general is actually equal for usability. Try Debian Linux. Free in both senses of the word. Never will be driven by any corporate profit sheet. Easily maintainable, many, many, many reasons to use it. If you really looked at the whole "issue" you wouldn;t be complaining. You'd be helping out. Until you do understand you are just spreading FUD (Fear, uncertainty and doubt).

Originally posted by jimf43: Quote: Originally posted by trondare: Quote: Reiserfs is not broken in 2.6.8.1. I see nothing about this in the kernel mailing lists, forums, kerneltrap, slashdot or anywhere else. I'm using 2.6.8.1-ck1 and reiserfs myself, so how can you say it's broken? Are you stupid, a troll, or just asking to be flamed? M'kay. Quick thinking there. I am sure he isn't stupid, mainly because I see no indication of ReiserFS(v3.5/6) problems in the LKML (which there would be). I myself have seen reiserfs 3.5/6 literally yank out the top level tree upon a reboot. Just becuase I changed kernels. Whereas these 2 kernels have been installed and swapped regular like. Just because he is challenging your *GLOBAL* announcement the Reiserfs is broken on your machine, therefore it must be broken everywhere, is no reason to give him the STFU TROLL regimen. Just to give you a clue I had a 3TB array on ReiserFS v3.6 recently "lose" its tree. Was sitting there serving files all fine, when all of a sudden, nearly EVERYTHING was gone. Brought the spare machine up. Made a 3TB array available to the machine, mkfs.xfs (I wanted to it in production before, but had little chance) as I had tested it and gotten better utilization and performance. Restored. Returned to service in about 30 minutes, with the restore going as the people were using it. Sometimes waiting for files to show up. The original machine, I ended up trying to fsck it, no good, even some expensive proprietary tools I have couldn't do a thing with it. I ended up having all files under lost+found. Yes, at least I could get to some of them... but the point is: If you aren't prepared for amykind of disaster, you aren't worth keeping around. Have fun.

Ummm, the docs say you need to copy the installer script to a writeable place. And, I setup a directory /usr/games/ut2004 Gave ownership to the user I use for installs. I then ran the installer from the writeable location. The DVD install went JUST FINE! If it asks for another CD press enter. Then once everything is setup right... switch users and run the game as /usr/games/ut2004/ut2004 You shall se some nice things. Once you verify that it works, go get the update for it. 3286 is the version IIANM. Luck!

Quote: I received a warning today from Tech Republic that the main source code for the Linux kernel was hacked last week. A hacker changed just 2 lines of the code which would of enabled him/them to gain access over a system running that code. The invection was spotted several days later and rectified. What is the best messure to ensure security on the net while using Linux? NO... NO... NO... NO... NO... NO... Debian servers got compromised using the Kernel integer Overflow. Not a buffer overflow... this one was extremely hard to detect. Its effects are affecting Every Kernel to a certain revision. There is also a CVE for it. Give it a rest. Debian Security Announcemnet 403-1 DO not ever spread the word like this. The two lines of code were bad to begin with. And it was a LOCAL exploit only. So they would have to get onto the machine first with a valid account then exploit the vulnerability.

Boot from the CDROM, use the tools available to you in it. Like lspci, lsmod among quite a few others. Once you see how Knoppix treats it, you'll know exactly how it us supported. Knoppix Primary FTP site I use KNOPPIX for hardware discovery, it's got "Super-Computing Hardware Detection POWERZ"

There are things to be said for Debian. But IF I do say them here I'll get censored again. Needless to say, Gentoo has it's place. But all I can say is dependencies SUCK in everything EXCEPT Debian. People don;t understand Debian and therefore bad mouth it. If you really WANT to know more. Ask.

I need to know Which disk, (hda , hdb, jdc, hdd, etc...) What your "/" partition is, you /boot partition is, Your Windows Partition is. What you current menu.lst looks like. Get those, and I can help.

Code: title WindowsXProotnoverify (hd0,0)makeactivechainloader +1 You forgot to make it active.

Please post the error exactly please. I am guessing you are using KDE. Goto the Control Panel and poke around in the SOUND sections... you'll find a "use full dupley" mode for the sound server. Uncheck that. Save the settings. Logout and login. If you still have probs, post the EXACT error message... with codes and all.

Perhaps a HUGE bug that was found that core dumps ANYthing except RedHat? Also, nVidia also does unified developement for Drivers... the things that change from platform to platform is the HOOKS they use... The Code is supposed to exactly the same... If you were to read the developers lists for nVidia... you'd find out that nVidia is probably the BEST about giving and providing support to Card Manufacturers. Also, that when they release 43.45 for Windows they *COULD* release 43.45 for Linux... Same goes for nForce drivers.

You sound very silly. nVidia's Drivers for Linux and FreeBSD The only reason nVidia got it for the X-Box was they undercut ATI... by a wide margin... But got more imbursement from *other* deals from Microsoft. The fact they won't open-source the drivers... may mean they have some patented IP from other corporations that do not want to open up the IP they have. It could be *JUST* one... Open Source is not a magic Bullet. It is a way of thinking. BTW, the version Numbers for the Linux Video Drivers is 43.49... whereas the Latest official Windows Version is 43.45. And the Latest nForce drivers for Windows is 2.03... Linux is 2.48.... Hmmm... what was that you were saying?

Try the "8139too" driver. modprobe 8139too It is not well detected by ANY kernel at this point. You nearly have to force it to load... but once it does... you should be good to go.

It'll help you a lot... it works very well... I have always said learn by example... *REAL* examples... *WORKING* examples.... That is what I have given you... There are quite a few books on IPTABLES.... New Riders has a couple of good books on IPTABLES.

This IPTABLES script. I wrote this one. It works REALLY well... It just works.

http://www.beowulf.org/ http://www.beowulf-underground.org/ To get you started.

nearly every distro I have used has a couple of commands called "ifdown" and "ifup". As "root" do these commands like this: Code: ifdown eth0 ; ifup eth0 Or on a RedHat machine, as "root": Code: service network restart There are other versions but the first one almost always works.

Quote: I only whant you to tell me the best distro for a server. 8) Is Debian. It's the install once and maintain forever Distro of Linux... You can pick your bleed level, do on-line upgrades, even recover from MASSIVE stupidity... BUT, it is not for the Newbie to Linux at all... See my previous post about Linux Distibutions This post here Should help you understand WHY I say so...

This is not a package manager discussion. What I want to know, those of you that evangelize *ANY* distrobution... I evangelize that you use something SANE... (I am going to be picking on RPM mainly cause it is usually RPMers doing the deed) This is a FIA: frequently iterated argument. An often asked Question: Can any of the resident deb-o-snobs explain to me what is so horked about RPM? In a word: policy[/list:u]First, the package format itself is largely comperable with Debian's debs. It's not an RPM v. DEB thing, it's a no-policy v. policy thing. Debian isn't a packaging tool. It's a system, with policy, enforcement and execution tools, documentation, culture, community, and infrastructure. There are several cargo-cult attempts to replicate Debian's success by implementing portions of the model. "Debian uses DEBs, we'll used DEBs." "Debian uses APT, we'll use APT," etc. These efforts Don't Get It. There are a number of corollaries. Among the principle ones are dependency resolution, treatment and handling of config files, file locations, documentation, and system upgrades. This is well-trod ground, and the best way for you to understand is for you to try it yourself. I've seen few people who've not been impressed. I've seen many who've become rabid partisans. Most of these partisans are veterans of other Linux or 'nix distros or flavors -- it's a partisanship based on familiarity with alternatives and technical merits. The principle arguments are abstracted in: You might also want to look at this DistroWatch article, Is RPM Doomed? (though it makes the classic mistake of confounding package formats with policy). Nick Petreley's Make Debian the base standard: apt-get beats RPM.[/list:u]Another often spoken statemnet in this "WAR" I've had a lot of Linux issues but rpm was never one of them. It works perfectly at the user level, and the installer level if the latter knows how to script things correctly. I've never had a corrupt database. What's wrong with rpm? Huh? If it works for you, I can't argue. As for needing to rebuild an RPM database, congratulations. Though I've found myself with twisted package lists, and have heard horror stories (Jim Dennis, of LinuxGazette Answer Gang fame in particular) from people who've had borked RPM databases. RH may have addressed this issue, I don't know. Use of APT is fairly well documented: APT HOWTO. Could you point to comparable docs for your update tool? I'd ask how you'd approach the following tasks, though: -- Post-installation, add a package with heavy dependencies to other packages, say, Galeon (depends on 28 packages, including numerous GNOME libraries, specific Mozilla versions, and other support packages). -- Cleanly remove a package, leaving configuration files in place. (apt-get remove) -- Cleanly remove a packge, purging configuration files. (apt-get remove --purge) -- Cleanly update a package, with explicit control over configuration file updates. (any installation) -- Prevent further updates to a specific package. (dpkg --set-selections & hold) -- Provide required system functionality with a locally managed package, and inform the package management system that you're providing a dependency. (equivs) -- Clone a system's packages to another system. (dpkg --get-selections, dpkg --set-selections) -- Utilize specific package repositories of your specification (rather than only the vendor's repository, often heavily contended). I'll also note in the news in November 2002 -- the destruction of the Twente University NOC, which hosts several Debian repository and infrastructure servers (security.debian.org, non-us.debian.org, nm.debian.org, qa.debian.org). Existing replicated and distributed structure means that repositories can be rapidly replicated and restored elsewhere. In fact klecker.debian.org (non-us.debian.org) was back online in 12 hours. -- Build and manage your locally-configured kernel as a package. (make-kpkg) -- Utilize non-native packages within your package management system (alien) -- Query a package and get its architecture without use of special output formatting directives. Hmm...thought I had a link to that, but no dice. man rpm(1) and see the --queryformat option. -- Live minor or major system upgrades. No downtime required. And to answer the pedantic "but I don't want to do live system upgrades!" crowd: well then, don't, that's your choice. But doing them is a choice under Debian. -- Pick of over software 10,000 packages (unstable). Stable distro? You're reduced to a mere 8,000+ packages. That's software built specifically for Debian, including policy. -- Man pages. Required by policy. -- Tools to check policy compliance. (lintian) -- Integrated, open, bug tracking system. (debbugs) -- Pick your bleed level: stable, testing, unstable, experimental. And if you want to get specific, pinning. (/etc/apt/sources.list) -- General major post-installation system surgery: major addition/deletion of packages, without going through packaging hell. On Debian this is in fact the Recommended Way Of Doing Things if you're exploring the distro: get a base system installed, then add the necessary packages on an as-needed basis. Typically a newbie goes through a couple days of intensive additions, a week or so of significant adds (and possibly deletes), followed by a longer period in which one might add/remove a package or so a few times a month.[/list:u]To the chagrin of Debian Snobs everywhere, I've often said myself that *IF* an RPM distribution had "Debian Policy" behind it, I'd use it too. Conectiva of Brazil is the company that created apt-rpm and synaptic, and produces an excellent distribution of the same name. It is the first and, as far as I can tell, only company to attempt true continuous incremental upgradeability/maintenance in the Debian fashion on an RPM-based distribution. So, you can see that BOTH DPKG and RPM are not the critical measure... the critical measure is Policy behind the building, testing and releasing of packages using a sane method of deployment. Is this better Clutch? Please don't delete this one... Thanks to Karsten M. Self for alot of the docs! Edits: For spelling mainly, formatting and credits

You see this is why, why Debian users get upset and become "Snobbians" as most put... We argue facts and policy against other distro's religion... Those of you that evangelize Gentoo... can't rebutt this... mainly there isn't comparable documentation and resources to show the procedure for doing a sane package realease. There are not guidelines for a QA process, or a TESTING (albeit short mabye) process... why? RedHat, don't even get me started... RedHat breaks itself regularly. Mandrake same thing, Slack is better, so are others... BUT, why do you supporters of "Cool" Distros not reply with counter points? Why must we drag you kicking and screaming into the discusson... mainly we are ready to show you our proof... I'd really like to see yours... Give me HONEST, straight forward answers to the Questions I asked in the first post. I am not asking for a "cause G3N700 R3WLZ!" I am asking for a well thought out lucid, documentable re-butt/answer to those questions I asked before. Gotta remember, this entire process comes out of the need for a choice of STABLE, RELIABLE and THOUGHTFUL deployment. Sure you can use your choice of "Stable", "Testing", "Unstable" or "Experimental". Those are just arbitrary Testing doesn't mean Broken... anymore that UNSTABLE mean "notuseable", but experimental DOES mean that... you break it "oh well". The STABLE => TESTING => UNSTABLE is a process that *USUALLY* weeds out most difficulties before they get to stable... I personally run a combo of Stable and pinned certain thing in "testing" for servers. Now for Workstations I use, I run Unstable... Haven't seen a single day of down time... maybe some irritation at having to use a defferent X Environment fo a couple of days... but still working. There is a common misconception that Debian is a "Our Way or the Highway" Distro... Well, just to pint out the obvious, I have Postgresql 7.2.4 with evrey-single option "ON" and Jabber with a *TON* of Optional Plugins... managed as local packages compiled by me with the Debian Build Systemmm... but with *MY* specifics for me. So I can;t see why or how people come to this belief.

Quote: It sounds like you might not be familiar with Gentoo and haven't been away from Debian much, which is cool. But you might want to give it a shot and evaluate the differences in package availability (not only total packages, which Debian should win hands down, but current versions of them as well) along with workstation/server performance before passing judgement. Since when do you put Pre-releases/beta/alpha into Production?? I am sorry... I don't. Tis what I mean about STABLE. Quality Control and Procedure and Process and Policy. I am guessing, you don't know me... I have tremendous *NIX back-ground... Do you remember Interactive/386? What about SLS? Maybe RedHat v3.0.3? Slack v1.3? Sorry, you are talking to one very seriously "emerge"d Linux Distro people out there. Let me ask you one thing, have you gotten Oracle to run on Gentoo? Or how about Bea's Weblogic on Slackware? OR maybe Coldfusion MX running on a 2.0.37 Kernel? What about SAPDB running as fast and doing the same work as an Oracle DB. Okay, claiming I don't *KNOW* or am not Familiar with Gentoo compile system being able to set controls... and build options globally. To me... it sounds as though you've never used Solaris, BSDi, AIX, OSF/1, Tru64 or HP-UX... you ever used pinstall? What about pkg-inst? what about pkg-add? SAM? SMIT? System-Adminstrator? Sorry, you have picked the wrong person to start claiming as though *I* don't have familiarity... I have put into production just about EVERY flavor of UNIX availabe in the past ten years... Have been using Linux since Late '94... First experience the *JOY* of FreeBSD in it fully featurelessness... Saw the burgeoning of the *OTHER* BSDs. Watched Novell literally RUIN UNIXware. I am an Expert Generalist... andone of the true Artists in Information Technology. Making nearly ANYTHING work well together... I don't program as a Job... I leave that to those better atune to that... me I implement, put the puzzle togeter... I finger things well before most... and get things done in multiples of most. So, if you think I am coming of this lightly... for YOUR information... I recently converted to Snobbian^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^HDebian from RPM based and "Source" based ditributions... I am in the process of converting all of my personal and "self-employment" machines to Debian... all out from underneath my users... and they don't even have a clue... Seems as though, RPM based Distrobution don't have an ONLINE Working while Upgrading, upgrade system.... SOMETHING I've always needed... I have ALWAYS had to manually update my RPM Distributions using scripts I have developed over the past 5 or so years. But, I need them not... For Debian's dpkg/apt system works *SO* much easier and without effort.. You must also, not know about pinning versions..or maybe making Debian track stable/testing/unstable all at the same time... using the pieces you want it to use when you want them to use them... Less hassle, more time for me to swat you around...

Please take a look at the file /etc/network/interfaces Code: ### etherconf DEBCONF AREA. DO NOT EDIT THIS AREA OR INSERT TEXT BEFORE IT.auto lo eth0iface lo inet loopbackiface eth0 inet static address 192.168.1.90 netmask 255.255.255.0 gateway 192.168.1.1### END OF DEBCONF AREA. PLACE YOUR EDITS BELOW; THEY WILL BE PRESERVED. If you have something like this... then you should be fine... if it is Code: ### etherconf DEBCONF AREA. DO NOT EDIT THIS AREA OR INSERT TEXT BEFORE IT.auto lo eth0iface lo inet loopbackiface eth0 inet dhcp hostname somename### END OF DEBCONF AREA. PLACE YOUR EDITS BELOW; THEY WILL BE PRESERVED. If you have something like that... do ifdown eth0 wait a few seconds then do ifup eth0 See if that takes care of the issue. Other than that... without more info on your DHCP server or you "LAN" we can't see into your mind ... though I'd like that ability to read most people's minds.... :x

Just how long does it sit there? It should timeout after about 4 minutes... Apt-get update is probably hanging on an out of date mirror string. It is waiting for DNS timeout, and FTP/HTTP timeout... Try the "archive.progeny.com " Edit your /etc/apt/sources.list and put in a set of the following. For Stable(Woody) use: deb ftp://archive.progeny.com/debian stable main non-free contrib deb-src ftp://archive.progeny.com/debian stable main non-free contrib For Testing(Sarge) use: deb ftp://archive.progeny.com/debian testing main non-free contrib deb-src ftp://archive.progeny.com/debian testing main non-free contrib For Unstable(Sid) use: deb ftp://archive.progeny.com/debian unstable main non-free contrib deb-src ftp://archive.progeny.com/debian unstable main non-free contrib Always good to use these... For Debian Security use: deb http://security.debian.org/ stable/updates main contrib non-free And for Java: deb ftp://ftp.tux.org/pub/java/debian woody non-free The do: apt-get update apt-get -u upgrade or apt-get -u dist-upgrade Follow prompts from there.

Quote: Debian is sweet, but once you master it and you start looking for more speed and control out of your system, check out Gentoo (www.gentoo.org). Their "stable" version carries newer packages than the latest "bleeding edge" version of Debian that you will find, plus it compiles everything locally on your machine versus using canned binaries that someone else made with what flags they thought were needed. Id on't get what you are talking about... I have as much control and speed as I can get... If you want you can rebuild your system nightly from source with debian... Stable is Just that STABLE. Code: knight:~# apt-build infoapt-build 0.8Usage: apt-build [options] [command] <package>apt-build is a simple command line interface for downloading,building and installing packages.Commands: update - Retrieve new lists of packages upgrade - Perform an upgrade install - Build and install new packages (pkg is libc6 not libc6.deb) source - Download and extract source in build directory remove - Remove packages clean-build - Erase downloaded archive and built files update-repository - Update repository world - Rebuild and reinstall packages on your system info - Info on a package buildingOptions: --reinstall - Build and install an already installed package --rebuild - Rebuild program --remove-builddep - Remove build-dependencies installed by apt-build --no-wrapper - Do not use gcc/g++ wrapper --purge - Use purge instead of remove --build-command <comand> - Use this command to build package --patch <file> - Apply this patch before build --patch-strip | -p <number> - Prefix to strip on patch (0 = -p0, 1 = -p1...) --yes | -y - Assume yes --version | -v - Show version --no-source - Do not download source (assume source are already extracted in build dir) --build-only - Do not install builddep and <package> --build-dir - Specify build dir --repository-dir - Specify the repository dirknight:~# You can see mastering Debian is not what you think it is... Lets look at a specific Package like Postgresql 7.2.3 Code: knight:/var/cache/apt/archives/postgresql-7.2.1/debian# lsREADME.Debian libecpg3.shlibs pgaccess.1 postgresql-dump.inREADME.Debian.backups libpgperl.dirs pgaccess.README postgresql-guideREADME.Debian.bugs libpgperl.files pgaccess.copyright postgresql-pl.postinstREADME.Debian.migration libpgsql2.dirs pgaccess.dirs postgresql-startup.inREADME.ecpg libpgsql2.files pgaccess.fonts postgresql-test.dirsREADME.odbc libpgsql2.postinst pgaccess.menu postgresql-test.postinstREADME.passwords libpgsql2.preinst.in pgaccess.postinst postgresql-test.postrmREADME.postgresql.conf libpgsql2.prerm.in pgaccess.prerm postgresql-test.substvarsREADME.security.WARNING libpgsql2.shlibs pgaccess.tcl postgresql.confREADME.test libpgtcl.dirs pgaccess.xpm.uu postgresql.conf.5alpha-fixes.dpatch libpgtcl.files postgres_mac.sql postgresql.envchangelog libpgtcl.overrides postgresql-6.5.3.tar.gz.md5 postgresql.initconffiles libpgtcl.postinst postgresql-client.conffiles postgresql.logrotatecontrol libpgtcl.shlibs postgresql-client.dirs postgresql.overridescopyright libpq.README postgresql-client.files postgresql.xpm.uucopyright.PyGreSQL logcheck.ignore postgresql-client.menu postinstcron.d logcheck.violations.ignore postgresql-client.postinst postinst.indirs make_pg_version postgresql-client.preinst.in postmaster.confdo.maintenance odbc-postgresql.dirs postgresql-client.prerm.in postmaster.conf.5dwww-index odbc-postgresql.files postgresql-contrib.dirs postrmenable_lang.in odbc-postgresql.overrides postgresql-contrib.overrides preinst.inextra.includes odbc-postgresql.postinst postgresql-dev.README prerm.infindoidjoins.1 odbc-postgresql.prerm postgresql-dev.dirs prerm.incfix.access.inc odbc-postgresql.shlibs postgresql-dev.files python-pygresql.dirsgenscript.sed odbc.copyright postgresql-dev.overrides readpgenvgenscript.warning odbc.ini.template postgresql-dev.postinst rulesget_old_bins.inc odbcinst.ini.template postgresql-dev.prerm save_db_schemaindexpage.html password.cnf postgresql-doc.dirs shlibs.locallibecpg3.dirs pg_dumpall postgresql-doc.postinst unixodbc.HOWTOlibecpg3.files pg_dumpall7.1 postgresql-doc.preinst watchlibecpg3.postinst pg_wrapper.1 postgresql-doc.prermlibecpg3.prerm pg_wrapper.c postgresql-dump.8 If we take a look we can see alot of files looking like they rely on special conditions. If a particular piece isn't there (for instance you run GNOME and only used Quanta for example) you will have to have the Qt support stuff for the KDE stuf (DCOP and such) before it'll even build Quanta... but the only parts there... wiil be built. Of course if you later decide to install KDE, you'll have to re-build that package again ti get the full KDE environment support there... BTW, you'll get few packages out of this build... postgresql-[ client | contrib | server(which is just postgreql) | test | docs | odbc | dev ] allowing you to not have to install the whole kit-n-kaboodle... It's all kinda... automagically done for you. You have to understand that the pre-built binary packages are designed to work in many, many different situations, platforms and environments... Debian's policy is to support as many platforms as possible... it why it sometime feels "slow" in development... but STABLE is just that STABLE... now Unstable or unstable/experimental you WILL regularly Break your system as someitme depenanciess will be totally screwed... but that's why it's UNSTABLE/Experimental. Sid (unstable) is pretty good, doesn't have problem for to long after they are introduced... so it's ok. if you can deal with it... I also have alternate GNOME support in other window managers I have on the system... Now, as for the patching system... it is awesome, automated and very easy to accomplish... especially for the Kernel... you just make sure you install the proper packages for building the Kernel, install the patches... when you run the make-kpkg command properly with the exported variable "PATCH_THE_SOURCE" = yes... it will... and you get your customized kernel and all... Now I hope this just isn't too much for now... additional questions followed up on... BTW out of the gate, Woody supported 10 hardware platforms plus Beowulf clusters in Linux... see Debian Ports. There are also Debian projects of NetBSD and FreeBSD... as well as i386-Hurd and one unreleased (in Alpha/Beta) for the Hitachi SuperH Processor... Oh yeah... one last thing... if you can Boot a Debian Machine *AND* you can get it to see the network or CDROM... you can re-deploy that Debian machine and literally *NEVER* have to re-install it ever. And it will clean-up behind itself VERY well... [/code]

And give a good Try for a few weeks, you will Never go back... It is all about the Quality Control... 3.0r1 is Woody, also known as "STABLE"... which it is except for Bug-fixes and Security updates... nothing get's extended. Next version is Sarge a.k.a. "TESTING" is very good... but it does break from time to time... rarely to the point where you cannot get things done... this will be the next "STABLE". I compare the stability of Testing to current Redhat and current Mandrake... they are comparable to this revision of Debian. After that we get to UNSTABLE or Sid... it is definately UNSTABLE... Bleeding edge... really close to what you could term developmental... Then we get to Experimental... OUCH... It is just that... as close to bleeding edge as you can be... except for it does not have a 2.5.x kernel. Everything you want to do is available in Debian Package and source archives... TONS (~11,000 packages) are available... all there for the piking!